Tuesday, February 28th, 2006...6:26 am
She’s Too Conservative, No Wait, She’s Too Liberal…
I’ve been involved in this silliness long enough that I should be long past the point where I can expect constistency.
For example, I worked for Sam Coppersmith’s Senate race in 1994. Coppersmith was assailed by Dick Mahoney for being some sort of conservative sell-out. Mahoney even ran one ad where Coppersmith’s mustache went back and forth onto Jon Kyl’s face with the tag line “Coppersmith and Kyl, can you tell the difference?” I remember Coppersmith being taken apart even by activists for not supporting Bill Clinton when he needed him.
(Of course, given what has happened in the meantime, being criticized by Mahoney for not being liberal enough would be like being criticized by Kevin Federline for being not talented enough)
I told Darcy Renfro, who directed the southern Arizona campaign, “Just wait, after the primary, Sam will be painted as some sort of Marxist.” Well, it took an extra two weeks because of a recount, but as soon as Coppersmith was confirmed as the nominee, Kyl was running ads claiming that Coppersmith was some sort of unreconstructed lefty who was too close to Bill Clinton.
Well, I suppose it is too much to expect consistency from different opponents. It is suprising however, when a candidate gets attacked from the right and left by the same set of opponents.
For example, when Gabrielle Giffords announced her campaign would be co-chaired by Dorothy Finley and Eddie Basha, I heard no end of complaints from supporters of other candidates. The complaints went something like this:
That Dorothy Finley is a Republican. And Basha? He’s anti-Union and a party switcher! See, Giffords is a closet Republican!
So, what claim have I been hearing over the last few days, from the some of the same people, by the way?
Giffords kicked Finley and Basha off of her committee because the Unions made her! See, this just proves that she’ll sell out to special interests.
First off, near as I can tell, Finley is still a co-chair of Giffords’s campaign. Basha’s name is no longer there. From what I know about Basha and Giffords, I have a feeling that he removed his own name. Basha is about to take a whole lot of grief from the UFCW (who has not yet endorsed); it is probably best that his name is off. He is also heading up an education initiative, and I’m pretty sure that he’ll take his name off of that as well.
Aside from that though, the knock against her before was that she was supported by people who were not liked by some liberal interest groups, now she is being taken to task for allegedly cowtowing to those same interest groups? Come on! Pick a criticism and stick with it.
Besides, I thought we wanted our candidates to take direction from labor.
Also, the evidence doesn’t bear out what folks are claiming. Despite the rhetoric of solidarity, the labor movement is not a monolith. Some labor organizations have supported Giffords, but as I said, UFCW has not endorsed. Although they recently signed a solidarity agreement with the State AFL-CIO, they still have an independent streak. I find it unlikely that other unions would be taking direction from one that other AFL-CIO members were raking over the coals a few months ago for a bitter public split with the national organization. And, one union, UTU, has endorsed Patty Weiss. I have spoken to some Steelworkers who are at the very least unenthusiastic about Giffords’s campaign, it is unlikely that they would take direction from a “rebel” union as well. Given Giffords’s recent support of SEIU, AFSCME can’t be too happy with her either.
But, why be consistent? Take her apart for getting support from one of those dangerous special interests who wouldn’t have been so dangerous if they were supporting your candidate.
NB - Speaking of labor, any word yet on whether Latas or Weiss support the right of county workers to organize? Giffords does. I suppose that just makes her a sell out to liberal interests. Unless it makes her part of some DLC vanguard. I am so confused!
33 Comments
February 28th, 2006 at 8:32 am
Well said Ted! As I mentioned on the Data Port, this smacks of a desperation. It makes me wonder seriously about whether the other campaigns are catching on at all. It also takes me back to what I said about primaries…over and over and over again. Primary voters are the most active, ideological, and inside the party. Gabby seems to be doing a remarkable job of winning these voters over first. The others are left clamoring for this support and attacking her when they don’t get it.
Last, let me say this…to those that are undecided (or those who I am courting like CC Burro..grin)…I am seeing a breadth of support for Giffords right now that I have not seen in quite some time. At a recent fundraiser I saw people to the left, people to the middle, activists, and people who have not been so involved. Come aboard and support her! We would love to have you.
February 28th, 2006 at 10:03 am
OK, but she’s still a Scrippsee.
February 28th, 2006 at 10:10 am
Oh Tedski stop bowing down to the powers that be & spinning for them (they wont pay you back) and have a backbone for once.
February 28th, 2006 at 10:15 am
I’d take the advice if you had the backbone to put your name down.
February 28th, 2006 at 10:24 am
So tedski is wondering if Latas is a union supporter? Well, it’s been said at the forums that Jeff grew up in a union household. Missed out on Christmases because his dad was on strike. Jeff has publicly ome out and said he is a union supporter. So there it is.
As a former Steelworker, I can say I would find that labor will have a friend in Congress with Jeff.
By the way, “Gabby” did indeed throw her chairs under the bus for the union endorsement. Basha is reportedly PISSED about this.
Can someone start singing: “Take the money and run.”
February 28th, 2006 at 11:15 am
TEDSKI–To correct an inaccuracy–They are not alleging that she is too liberal; they are alleging that she is opportunistic, a very different animal.
Why not go to the source? Why don’t you simply ask Gabby point-blank about this rumor? If this rumor is fabrication, this would be the best way to squelch it. If this rumor is true, then it is fair for the primary voters to know this.
FYI–Latas definitely supports the right of county workers [and all workers] to unionize.
February 28th, 2006 at 12:05 pm
That’s why Liberals need to take back the word Liberal. Don’t run from it, because as long as they think they can get votes out of it, Republicans will always call every Democrat Liberal (I mean, they used it to take out Charlie Stenholm two years ago, so I guess to them there is no such thing as a Democrat who isn’t a Liberal).
So, yeah, I’m a Liberal.
February 28th, 2006 at 12:49 pm
Gabby is following the DLC playbook. She speaks like Hillary, and she thinks raising money is more important than meeting voters.
She has Joementum and she is taking the same professional advice that brought Mary Judge Ryan and George Cunningham low votes and made them unelectable.
She seeks opportunities and deserves credit for being an opportunist.
She would certainly disavow the Prezelskis if she thought it would give her traction. Millionaire Democrats and Republican lobbyists have given her the money to win, but they can’t get her the votes as easily.
Unelectable is the WORD that follows the Gabby money trail.
Eddie Basha has friends that I WOULD never cross. Life is too short.
Dorothy Finley is a good Republican and Gabby’s mentor, and Gabby is a quick learner. She is both transactional and unelectable.
February 28th, 2006 at 1:58 pm
Well Ted, Latas is listening. Here is a link to his diary on the Dailykos, http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/2/28/144649/427, I think he makes his point loud and clear he’s pretty union blue.
February 28th, 2006 at 2:04 pm
Wow, good post on the kos.
February 28th, 2006 at 2:18 pm
FYI…UA Young Democrats will host Gabby tomorrow (Wed) at 7:30ish in the Union Kiva room.
And before you all get your undies in a twist, all candidates will be invited to campus as UAYD does not endorse during a contested Primary.
February 28th, 2006 at 2:40 pm
…Republicans will always call every Democrat Liberal… And every moderate, and every libertarian, and every Green, and every Independent…
February 28th, 2006 at 4:33 pm
And this is why the Democratic party and its members blow. Cant agree on anything! This is why Repubs win people!
February 28th, 2006 at 5:33 pm
you hit the nail on the head “who cares!”
They’re too busy eating their own, trying to figure who’s a real liberal and who has forgotten where they came from … or something like that.
Shoot. Might as well just save money and hand the election over now.
February 28th, 2006 at 6:16 pm
First, these silly little disagreements are just that…silly…and they will not keep anyone here from rallying around the candidate that is chosen…there are good Democrat candidates who will be a big big plus over what you all are offering. I may not be speaking for everyone, but I cannot imagine the few venomous comments coming out in this discussion keeping support from Giffords when she takes this thing…or Latas and Weiss if they do.
Second, I can’t wait to see your own blood spillage in CD8 my Republican friends. Huffman/Hellon…the battle royale for the moderate voice…and Graf waiting to call them both liberals.
Roger
February 28th, 2006 at 7:20 pm
Wasn’t it Howard Dean that said, “When you run a Republican “Lite” against a Republican the real Republican wins every time.” We certainly know this to be true. In recent years Democratic candidates who have been afraid to stand up for traditional Democratic values always lose.
Gifford’s is not electable because her “boldest” idea seams to be. Compromise, go to the middle and give it up to them so you can get a little crumb. I don’t think so, not in the most remote sense do I believe Gifford’s can win thisrace.This is not personal at all—I have met Ms.Giffords and she seems to be very nice. But nice doesn’t win elections, bold ideas do. Ms.Giffords is too weak to stand up to the ugly Repug machine that will bulldoze everything in its path. if she wins this primary we lose the seat.
This DLC crowd have been using this same strategy for years. Let’s see, have Democrats been winning elections lately? Has going to the middle and not standing for anything been working? Yet, they keep doing it every election cycle?
The DLC people here in Arizonahave been been irrelevent for a while now–they just haven’t realized it yet. The reality is that they are still players because they have ties to big money and can raise money.
I can’t believe that anyone thinks that Gabby Giffords’ candidacy will result in anything other than another loss. If you do– Look up the definition of what constitutes Mental Illness.
Now I am not saying this to be unkind or to call people names, however, it happens to be true.
As Gabby gains support in this primary I see the opportunity to take his seat from the Republicans slipping away. I’m hoping like hell that this won’t happen. But I will fight them with all of my heart. As far as I’m concerned the Republicans will get this seat only if they stomp over my dead body to do so. That’s how serious I am about winning this race for the Democrats. I’m hoping that all good Democats are willing to fight for this seat with everything they have as well.
To Tedski, whomever you happen to be. Please know that– while doing the bidding of the leftover DLC here in Arizona you too may find yourself being labled irrelevent. I would hate to see that happen… you sound like you are passionate about your Democratic poltics and we certainly need more people in the party that have that same energy. Please get off this Gifford’s kick and try to help your readers evaluate this race fairly so the Democrat who can win the General Election is the Democrat that wins the primary—if you are not willing to use your critical thinking skills and help the community do the same in evaluating this race realistically– I’m afraid my dear you will become part of the problem.
BTW: Sam Coppersmith absolutely Arizona Democrats out. I was in the midst of the 1994 disaster and the party has never recovered. A freshman Congressman from a conservative district has no business running or the US Senate. The Arizona Democratic party was in shambles. Coppersmith let us down big time—the hundreds of volunteers who helped get him elected to Congress were especially let down—I was one of those many hundreds.
I remain anonymous because of the nature of my job..
February 28th, 2006 at 8:17 pm
Roger – Your Republican friend here. I can’t wait either for the Huffman/Hellon battle so Randy can win. Bravo!
John
February 28th, 2006 at 8:52 pm
First, hey to Phx Kid (John)…I think you may get your wish! Then I will get mine. Which leads me to the Anon above you…
My wish and hope is that Giffords wins the primary and unlike you, I think she can deliver the election. I am not sure who you are supporting but I am guessing, only guessing, that it is Latas or Weiss. I think you are absolutely wrong about Giffords and the DLC….I think you are also wrong about the depth of her support. I see the worries that you have thrown out. That she may be too moderate or wishy washy as a candidate and that it will give the voters no choice but to vote Republican. I think you will be quite suprised to see her conviction as this campaign develops. I also think you will be quite suprised at how many liberals…died in the wool liberals…are in support of her and her candidacy. They are not deluded, I assure you. It may be that Gabby is having to react so much because some, like you, keep attacking her….and I will end by saying this. You are doing her the best of services. No candidate is perfect…no public servant is perfect. What you are doing is pointing out the simple little flaws that she will be able to work on and deflect as the campaign goes along. If anything you say is true, and I am doubting a lot of it (because I think you are trying to tear her down in order to elect whoever you are working for…it smacks of desperation)…if any of it is true, you are only going to sharpen her now, for what will come this fall.
Next, back to my Republican friend Phx Kid…if you get your wish with Graf, I can assure you that Anon will be wrong about Giffords ability to win.
February 28th, 2006 at 8:59 pm
One more thing…I’d like to remind the readers here that this district leans Republican…and has a lot of independents…maybe majority. This is not a liberal district. While Giffords is liberal on many many issues, she is not an abashed ideologue. She is reasonable. To “anon” this might smack of selling out or not being liberal enough, but I would just have any of you look at the list of her supporters on www.giffordsforcongress.com. Stanley Feldman, Andy Silverman, a host of Democratic party elected officials. If anyone here wants to call Former Justice Feldman or Professor Silverman a conservative Democratic…well…should I say more?
February 28th, 2006 at 9:05 pm
Is Dorothy Finley and Eddie Basha a part of her committee still?
I’m confused that it will look like she deserted them for some union endorsements when they might still be working the money from a back room.
She needs to show some DLC spine and let her supporters know the real story about Ms. Finley and Mr. Basha.
Its really about having an image that plays well with the primary voters and the contributors might have to keep a low profile and keep her negatives from blooming like dandelions.
She still needs to define her image as something other than a creature of privilege and rolling up her sleeves and getting the union endorsements will let her look like Rosie the Riveter, better than the militaristic flight suit photo that reminds me of: Mission Accomplished!
February 28th, 2006 at 9:11 pm
TO WHO CARES!/ANONYMOUS–Much irony in that you are saying the Democrats can’t agree on anything when the Republican party has been imploding over their total fiscal irresponsibility of the past several years, corruption, Medicare part D, immigration, etc. and eating, no, spitting out its moderates.
TO ANONYMOUS AFTER ELI–That is the most no-substance, no-logic rant that I’ve seen on this blog. Do you know the meaning of the word “alleged”? What’s your problem? Did Giffords steal your cookies in a previous life?
TO ANONYMOUS AFTER KRALMAJALES–DLC irrelevant in Arizona? You think Napolitano [DLC associated “New” Democrat] is irrelevant?
February 28th, 2006 at 9:21 pm
It is alleged that many of Gabby’s supporters have been known to maximize shareholders’ profits at the expense of the Democratic Party and common sense.
More DLC boilerplate from the New Democrats does not seem to play well where people don’t wear ties.
If you can fake sincerity, you’ve got it made. I wonder where the genuine candidate is?
We read lots of predictions here but little strategy to get someone elected who can win the general election.
If the Finleys and Bashas were dropped for expediency, when will the DLC disavowal begin?
February 28th, 2006 at 9:29 pm
So, OK, you SAY that Giffords cannot win the general election… (which I completely disagree with because the amount of support she has secured will translate into real votes…and I don’t think that any of three candidates can lose to what the Repubs have to offer)…
So who are you supporting that can win the general election? and Why? You’ve attacked over and over who I am supporting. I now will listen to you and I think many here are wondering…who are you supporting, why? and why can they win in the fall?
February 28th, 2006 at 9:41 pm
Jeff Latas, Alex Rodriguez and Patty Weiss are definitely not cut from the Status Quo.
They are less likely to disavow their roots to win some ephemeral endorsements.
This election is about getting votes, not getting money and endorsements.
Both Patty Weiss and Jeff Latas support unions and minimum wage increases for working people.
Alex Rodriguez is very capable and likeable, and his life on the border is compelling.
Managing El Campo does not seem to have the same narrative that the other candidates bring to the election.
The working class is different from the rich, they have less money.
February 28th, 2006 at 9:58 pm
It appears that Giffords supports unions as well. She has had their support in the past and appears to be getting their support again. As to the minimum wage, one of the primary movers, if not creators of the current minimum wage initiative is supporting Gabrielle Giffords…
As to endorsement and money not getting votes…I would just say that you are right…its not the only thing, but you underestimate the number of votes Giffords is winning and has won from people she has aided in our state legislature…as a public servant. Only Rodriguez, of those you have named, has any real experience in public office…
If experience and wealth is an evilish status quo then the revolution has a long way to go to influence me.
February 28th, 2006 at 10:28 pm
Roger is correct on this one. This race is wide open. Whom ever the Republicans nominate will need to do some serious healing of his party. This will give the Democratic nominee an opportunity that will have to be skillfully used. Either side could loose be making a gaffe. The race will probably come down to who can best unify his/her party.
February 28th, 2006 at 11:09 pm
Gabby has created either the impression or the rumor that Ms. Finley and Mr. Basha have been asked to move aside or to the back room.
This has not been answered except in whispers.
DLC and wealth aside, Basha and Finley are not known to be supporters of workers and universal health care.
If Gabby is distancing herself from her early adopters, will she be likely to win votes or lose them?
This is the question that CD8 needs answered.
February 28th, 2006 at 11:44 pm
Earlier today only Jessica Finley was on the list of endorsements at Gabby’s site.
Tonight,Dorothy Finley has reappeared as an endorsement.
So everything is okay again on the endorsement list. Only Eddie Basha has yet to reappear.
March 1st, 2006 at 12:48 am
Eddie Basha is Back!! Wow……can someone say FLIP FLOP FLIP FLOP
DLC and wealth aside, Basha and Finley are not known to be supporters of workers and universal health care.
Does anyone know if El Campo workers had adequate healthcare and benefits when it was under Gifford’s ownership? Were they unionized? If not, why not?
March 1st, 2006 at 6:59 am
Gone, back, gone, back…people have disputes. It appears that this one has been ironed out and managed. Many may find this flip/floppy and not endearing. Fine. But the fact is, the other candidates do not have the endorsements nor the support of these two individuals.
I am going to get heat for what I am about to say, but this sounds like an effective campaign to me.
March 1st, 2006 at 8:38 am
Tedski didn’t like his little candidate of choice being called out anonymously. Boo Hoo
Wow, way to quiet the critics Tedski. They must be paying you tons of money to run this blog and make sure it stays Pro-Giffords and all the critics are silenced.
March 1st, 2006 at 9:18 am
Hey I don’t mind having the “anons” around at all. In fact, some of the Gabby bashing anons got me to write another check to my favorite candidate. I still continue to tell my friends about her and I am finding that, much to my surprise, they are already on board. In addition, I think it tells the rest of the readers how very desperate the supporters of the other candidates are to get supporters in this race.
So, I wouldn’t have squelched you…
March 1st, 2006 at 10:46 pm
man I wish Ted was doing this blog fulltime…he could do stuff on my district more….oh wait he already is! Does this mean I owe you money Ted?
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